Episode Transcript
[00:00:16] Speaker A: Welcome to the clear admit MBA admissions podcast. I'm Graham Richmond, and this is your wiretaps for Monday, October 14, 2024. For more than 100 years, Emory University's Goisueta Business school has been a training ground for principal leaders and a laboratory for powerful insights. Whether you're looking to accelerate your career or make a career pivot, Emory's one year and two year full time MBA programs prepare you for a lifetime of career confidence. Learn more about Emory's top 20 MBA with top five career outcomes offering world class academics and small by design classes delivered in a dynamic global city. More at Emory, bizarre clear admit. I'm joined by Alex Brown from Cornwall, England. Alex, how are things going this week?
[00:01:05] Speaker B: Very good, thank you, Graham.
[00:01:06] Speaker A: Greetings from Los Angeles, California. That's where I am this week, recording this episode on my end. I had a chance to get over to Anderson the other day, caught up with Alex and Lawrence, who we did a podcast with him over the summer at the GMAC conference. Great guy. And yeah, we're just talking a lot about how well Anderson did. I think they were one of the first schools that we talked about on the podcast when we were doing the kind of class profiles this year, they were early out of the gate with their numbers because they had such a great class this year. Really high application volume, all that stuff.
[00:01:36] Speaker B: Very good.
[00:01:36] Speaker A: Yeah, it's been nice and sunny. Nice and sunny out here. I'm a little tired because of the jet lag, but, yeah, lots of fun. So what's going on with deadlines at this point and Livewire and stuff?
[00:01:48] Speaker B: Yeah, I mean, we've got lots of interview activity on Livewire last week, obviously, talk about Harvard had released their interview invites, but Columbia dropped theirs last week, or at least the majority of theirs, and lots of other schools sort of still trickling them out. So a lot of interview invite activity this upcoming week. We've got round one deadlines from the consortium, Rice, McCombs, Carey, Carol, Kelly, Mendoza, and Warrington, Florida. Warrington Stern has a round two deadline. Imperial is inviting folks for interviews next week.
They're scheduled to, and Duke Fuqua is releasing decisions for its early action round. So lots, lots of activity.
[00:02:41] Speaker A: Yeah. Okay. Yeah, we'll stay tuned. And it's been great watching everyone share their updates on Livewire and engage in debate. And there's still the classic when people post something, there's always the commenters who say, well, exactly what time and when did you submit your app? And people are always trying to do the math on this stuff. And I just want to remind everyone that there is no real math to it. The schools have often a dozen readers on their staff who are reading files. And sometimes an early application might get read first. Sometimes it may not, if that person who was assigned as your reader happens to be off doing a fair or whatever.
I know it's hard if you're waiting, but don't read too much into the timing of some of these things.
[00:03:23] Speaker B: An interview invite from somewhere like Yale and.
[00:03:27] Speaker A: Right, there are some schools. Yeah, like that. Yeah. So we have a bunch of events coming up. So this Wednesday we're doing our west coast webinar and that's going to include Berkeley, Stanford, UC Irvine, UCLA, and University of Washington Foster. You can still sign up for it if you're just hearing about this for the first time. Now just go to bit ly west Coastmba. That'll be a great event. And we've seen a lot of signups for it. So I mean, it's rare to get all those great west coast schools in one place, so that'll be kind of cool. And we have Mike on our team is going to moderate that and he's come up with a lot of really good questions and just sort of ways to tease out not only application sort of tips and things, but also kind of things that are unique about getting an MBA out on the west coast. So that'll be fun. The other thing we've got is the week after. So next week, October 23, we're doing one of our real humans webinars and we're going to sit down with students from Tuck, Columbia, Darden and Duke. And you can sign up for that by going to bit ly rhlive 1024. So please join us for that as well. Should be fun. And Alex, it doesn't stop there. We've got deferred enrollment events. So all those top MBA programs that allow you to apply when you're still at university, we're doing two events with them. We've got Harvard, Stanford, Wharton, I mean got Columbia, all the great kind of top programs who offer those deferred enrollment programs. We're doing a couple of events in November, and then in December we're actually going to do a couple events around masters in management programs again with a bunch of top schools. So I'll give links for those later down the road. But just wanted everyone to know they're, they're coming. So we're going to have a very busy fall with events going to be busy.
So uh, we did an admissions tip on the website last week that is, you know, if there was probably one admissions tip you should read before you go to an interview, it's probably this one. It's called five MBA interview questions you need to ace. And it's so important that not only did you write an article about it, but you and I recorded a admissions academy video about these five questions. And so, any thoughts on that, Alex? I mean, this is the kind of bread and butter stuff that you need to know going into an interview.
[00:05:36] Speaker B: The ones you need to Ace, because they're very likely going to be coming up, right? So I assume, and I haven't read that piece for a little while, but I assume it'd be things like the goals essay, why this school, et cetera, et cetera.
[00:05:48] Speaker A: Yeah, walk me through your resume. Might be one of them, right? Yeah.
[00:05:52] Speaker B: Yeah. So these are very standard, fair questions. Regardless of whether the interview is a blind interview or a resume based or an application based interview, some variant of these questions will come up.
[00:06:05] Speaker A: Yeah, absolutely. So check that out on the site. We continue to connect with current students at all of the top MBA programs in the world. And this week we caught up with three different schools. Students at three different schools. So we caught up with UNC Keenan Flagler students. And I want to just share a quote from one of the students we caught up with. Her name is Reba and she's from Rio in Saudi Arabia. She had studied architecture and then had a career in marketing and kind of consumer packaged goods before coming to Kenan Flagler for her MBA. And we asked her, we always ask a whole bunch of cool questions. One of the questions we asked was, what is one thing you would change or do differently in terms of the application process? And she said, looking back, I wish I had allowed myself more time to explore and reflect on my personal story before diving into the application process. I was so focused on perfecting my resume that I didn't initially give enough attention to understanding what truly drives me and how to best convey that in my essays. Once I took a step back and connected the dots between my experiences and my future goals, everything fell into place more naturally. So if I could do it again, I'd spend more time upfront on self reflection. It really made a difference in how authentic my application felt. What do you think of that, Alex?
[00:07:25] Speaker B: Read our admissions book. I know that's exactly what we tell folks. Take a step back, do a personal inventory, really understand, and do that introspection and self reflection first, and then tackle the different MBA admissions applications.
[00:07:41] Speaker A: Yeah, it's hard because I think there's this temptation to dive right in? And oh, what essay question are they asking? But yeah, Reba said it really well. I thought so. Great advice. We also caught up with Anne Charlotte, who is at IMD Business school in Switzerland and she is from a place called Odense in Denmark. And she worked for four years at Amazon in London in a senior strategy consultant role. And I think we asked her in terms of like, the question we asked her was like, why IMD? And she said IMD truly stood out to me as the perfect choice. Its small, diverse cohort, along with a strong focus on personal development and leadership really resonated with what I was looking for. I wanted more than just a year of academic learning. I was seeking an experience that would help me grow as a leader and enhance my interpersonal skills. IMD offered all of that and more. Beyond the traditional curriculum, I was drawn to the emphasis on those overlooked but crucial skills like negotiation, executive presence, presentation skills and mindfulness. These are the kinds of abilities that don't always get the spotlight but are so important in shaping a successful career. So that's Anne Charlotte over at IMD. What do you make of that, Alex?
[00:08:55] Speaker B: Really, really good. And obviously I think every time we talk about IMD, we hear a lot of the same theme and that sort of more intimate environment.
[00:09:04] Speaker A: Yeah, I agree. Yeah, they definitely seem to be, they have this kind of focus on, you know, kind of personal development, which seems to be, I think, of increasing import, right, given where we are with business and society. Lastly, we heard from Laura, who is currently studying at Indiana. Kelly. Laura is originally from Atlanta, Georgia, and she actually worked, you're going to love this. She worked for over ten years in what she described as youth development. And so I then read further to figure out, well, what is that? And she basically was running summer camps. She did some math teaching. She was helping to organize a program called Upward Bound, which is an outdoors program that I think is for to get kids maybe out of the city and out into the wilderness. So she spent a lot of time doing that, which is not your typical pre MBA profile. And we asked her, what is one thing you would absolutely do again as a part of your application process? And she said, I would absolutely repeat the process of visiting MBA programs in person where possible, or speaking to a recent alumni and students virtually when an in person visit is not an option. And then we also asked her, what's something you might change? And she said, I would have done more research earlier. I started thinking about getting my MBA years before I began reaching out to business schools. So she was kind of saying that, you know, wow, I knew I was thinking about an MBA, but I should have started earlier in terms of having conversations with students that could fuel my application materials and just help me find the right program. But anyway, I just thought it was interesting profile. I mean, what a. I mean, just. She's going to have a lot to offer in the classroom there, I'm sure.
[00:10:35] Speaker B: Yeah, no, I love that profile, quite honestly. And yes, if, you know, two or three years time, you're going to start planning to apply to MBA, you might as well start networking now, right? MBA programs offer a lot of resource for folks to learn about them and connect them with current students, alumni, et cetera, et cetera.
[00:10:56] Speaker A: Yeah, totally. Last thing I have before we get into this week's candidates is we continue to get these class profiles published by the top business schools. So I'm gonna give you a few of them and we'll go over the numbers. So the first one is Berkeley Haas. They just published their stats for the incoming class. They have 295 students in this year's class, similar to last year. 42% women. That's up 1%. 38% international. That's actually down from what we have here, is 47%. So they saw a decline in international applications, or at least admits 5.6 years of average work experience. That's down from 5.8. I'd venture a guess that that decline in international students probably helped to lower the average work experience, since I think internationals typically are a bit older and have more experience when they apply. Undergraduate GPA is a 3.65. That's up 0.1%. 0.1. Sorry. And then median GMAT score was a 730. That's down slightly from a 733 last year. And the GRE average is a 323. That's also down a tick from 324. What do you make of these numbers from Berkeley?
[00:12:08] Speaker B: They look good, quite honestly, just quite similar, I think, to last year. Here they're up a tick, or they're down a tick here and there. We don't know their application volume, but presumably that was up relative to previous years, like others that are other top schools that are reporting. And again, you've got that 730 GMAT, which is really, really strong, and a 323 GRE, which is just not as strong.
So we see this quite consistently across a number of programs. Not all programs, but a number of programs where the GRE might be a better avenue.
But yeah, no, honestly, very good. That 730 average GMAT, again, is a little bit akin to the m seven than it is to the next tier. I think Sturm was another one we talked about last week. That, again, is not an m seven, but has that similar average GMAT school.
[00:13:06] Speaker A: Yeah, I would argue it's because these are top schools in major markets where there's a lot of competition. People want to be in the Bay Area or they want to be in New York. So these schools are getting great applications from students. We also heard from Stanford. They've published their class profile. They had 7295 applications. That's an 18% increase from last year, which is identical to the percentage increase that we saw at Wharton. They have 424 students in their class this year. That's actually down slightly. They had 431 last year. 44% of the student body is female. That's down from 46% last year. They have 39% international students, up two percentage points from last year. 5.1 average years of work experience, virtually unchanged from last year. 3.75 undergraduate GPA average. That's down slightly. It was 3.77 last year. Their average GMAT score is a 738. That's unchanged. Their GRE average is a 327. That's down one point from 328 last year. And they did share that 58% of their applicants took the GMAT. 42% took the GRE. And last year, those numbers were a little bit different. It was 61% taking the GMat and 39% taking the gRe. So we continue to see that shift where the GRE is increasingly just popular and gaining ground on the GMAT a bit. So, any thoughts on Stanford?
[00:14:37] Speaker B: Again, great numbers.
They told us that the application volume was up, so that's really good.
The rest of the profile looks very similar to last year, but, yeah, that's 738 on the GMAT. That's one of the top scores across all programs, I would think. Yeah, 327 Gre is slightly less competitive, but still actually, relative to other top programs, that's probably ranked second or 3rd, 3rd across top programs. Oddly enough, I think Yale still probably is in front of them in that regard. Yeah, and it's nice that they tell us the percent that's taking the GMAT and the percent that's taking the GRE. And then when you add those two percentages up, it gets to 100%.
[00:15:28] Speaker A: I like that. Yeah, because you have to take a test to get into Stanford, and it.
[00:15:32] Speaker B: Has to be one of those two tests because we've got many. Again, top programs are just allowing all sorts of tests. That's been the turn. It just really muddies the waters, I think.
[00:15:45] Speaker A: So, last but not least, we have a class profile from Washington University in St. Louis. That's the Olin School of Business that just came out as well. They have 103 students in their MBA program, which is actually 25% larger than the class size was last year. So they've grown the program a bit. Still a very small program. They had the highest application volume there, though, in the last ten years, they shared that information in their profile, they have 53% women in their class. So they've actually gone beyond gender parity. They have 44% international students. Average work experience, 4.4 years. The average undergraduate GPA is 3.53.
Average GMAT score, 706. Average GRE, 327.
And those are the only numbers they gave. And I didn't have last year's profile handy. I don't think we had written about it last year year, because I couldn't find the data. But the only thing I should add is that those test score numbers, 706 GRE or GMAT, and 327 GRE, are for people who took a test. And this is a program that does not actually require that you take the GMAT or the GRE. So I'm assuming that there are people who applied without a test that are obviously not going to be in those numbers. But, yeah. What do you make of this profile?
[00:17:02] Speaker B: Yeah, we talked about this a little bit as a team, and it's something that I'm quite interested in exploring. So for Washington Olin, I think these numbers are really, really good.
Having 100 students in the class is actually very good for that tier of a program, because that's one thing that obviously we've seen as you move down the tiers. So for Washington Olin, it's sort of top 25, top 20, top 25 type tier. As you move down the tiers, the class sizes get smaller on average. There are obviously some anomalies to that. But having 100 in the class from their tier, I think, is a really good number.
So you might see some of their peer schools have 50 or 60. Right?
So I think that's really good. 53% women. Outstanding.
But, yeah, the waters are modded with this tier of school because, again, a lot of them do wave, allow candidates to waive the test.
And as a result of that, our assumption is some of the candidates that they admitted, if they actually had to take the test, might have driven down some of those average test scores.
We don't know that, but that's sort of the speculation because, I mean, the average GMAT, 706 is really, really strong for that tier. And the average gre, well, it's the same as Stanford. So you have to say that's very strong.
So there's definitely some issue at hand with schools that do allow test waivers in terms of how to interpret those average numbers and potentially application strategy for candidates targeting those programs. Because if you're targeting an m seven, I would say unequivocally, don't try to seek out a test waiver. You've got to show them your best across the entire application, across your entire profile. But perhaps when we're getting to that fourth or fifth tier of programs, which is still very strong program, it's more regionally focused but still very strong, maybe there's some merits in being more judicious in terms of whether you take the test.
[00:19:24] Speaker A: I agree.
[00:19:25] Speaker B: Or whether you submit the test.
[00:19:26] Speaker A: Yeah, no, I agree.
Just real quick, one thing. You point out that size 100 students and stuff, I agree. Ive talked to a number of smaller programs over the years who talk about when you hit that hundred mark, you sort of become a bit more worthwhile to employers that are thinking of coming to campus and youre pumping out more alums into the workforce. And so some things start to happen when you get up to that number. So good work on their part. I could not agree more, though, that the waters are really muddied. They have really great average test scores, but we don't really know what percentage of the class took a test. And so it's a little bit, it's unfortunate. I just wish that there were kind of reporting standards in place, and it seems like there really aren't. So in any event, this is all kind of a byproduct of the pandemic and the whole sort of implementation of waivers in the first place. So anyway, but, yeah, so those are the profiles for this week. I think we should probably move on and talk about our candidates. I did want to make one last kind of request that people review and rate this show. So if you're listening on Spotify or if you're listening on Apple, please leave us a review. Tell a friend. That's the only way people learn about the show. And I think our goal is to be that sort of companion week in and week out for candidates as they travel through the process. So tell a friend, anyone you know who's applying to business school, to tune in. But, Alex, should we talk about this week's candidates?
[00:20:45] Speaker B: Let's get Kong.
[00:20:46] Speaker A: All right, so this is wiretaps candidate number one.
Our first candidate this week has nine schools on the target list, and they're looking to start school in the fall of 25. The schools they're considering are Berkeley, Cornell, Duke, MIT, Stanford, UNc, Wharton, UT, Austin and Uva Darden. This person's got a career as a project manager in tech. They're thinking about getting into consulting, ideally with a tech kind of bent to it. So they mentioned Bain and BCG, Deloitte, Ernst Young, McKinsey. They also listed some tech companies too. But I think they're very much interested in kind of a consulting angle. They took the GRE and had a score of 332. They have a GPA from undergrad of 3.36 years of work experience. To date. They tell us that they're located in Africa. They didn't specify a country. I don't think they want to land in the US after business school. And they mentioned that their undergraduate degree, where they have that 3.3 was in economics, but that they also took a master's degree in tech and innovation management.
And they've done some international study and work experience. Their GPA in that master's degree was a 3.48. So a little bit higher than their undergraduate degree. They did also work in finance for a little bit for a couple of years and they had a short spell in SAP consulting before moving into this project manager role in tech. So Alex, I know that you engaged with this candidate on our website, had a little bit of back and forth, but what do you make of their chances? They have a nice list of target schools with some real, you know, heavy hitters, as you would say. But yeah, what do you make of their chances?
[00:22:29] Speaker B: I actually like their strategy in terms of, you know, nice sort of spread of top programs that they're targeting.
I think believe they might be from Ghana or at least they've done some additional activities related to Ghana. So that was my clue there.
Supergre, as we know, we just went through these CAS profiles. It's above all three of the programs we highlighted. It's above any program's median, actually, that we've reported. So that's very good because a three three out of potentially gone and maybe that's a good GPA. We don't absolutely know. So we're getting a better benchmark from the test score. They've got that grad GPA too, but with grad school, three four eight is probably actually not as good as the three three undergrad for whatever reasons. But anyway, as long as they can show that sort of impact and growth at work, they can provide good insight in terms of why they switch from one role to the next. Et cetera, et cetera, and they make a really strong case for their goals. And why MBA? They're probably slightly older candidates, so they just need to make sure why now makes a lot of sense. I think you talked a little bit before we came on out about this notion of making sure to clearly distinguish the MBA experience to the previous master's experience because it has some business relations. They obviously have econ in their undergrad, so they're applying to Sloan in round one, so they'll get an early signal of where they land off of that effort and that should help set them up for their round two application strategy. But I think what stands out here, quite honestly, Graham, is having a really strong test score out of Africa and hopefully that test score sort of reflects correlates with the rest of their profile.
[00:24:28] Speaker A: Yeah, I agree. These numbers are solid. I think that the fact that they have that grad GPA as well helps because it's a little bit higher than the undergrad GPA academically. I think they tick some boxes. I did, yeah. As we talked, they're going to need to make sure that. That masters in tech innovation and management doesn't seem too much like an MBA as they go through this process. But, yeah, it seems like an interesting candidate with a variety of experiences, both in finance and tech before business, the school and, yeah, I feel like they're. And as you pointed out, because they have a range of schools on their list, you know, they've got ut Austin and Keenan Flagler at UNC. They also have, you know, Stanford. Like, they will. They will land somewhere. I'm confident of that. So, yeah, we'll just see. I mean, it would have been great if they applied in the first round, but I don't think it's, you know, they're not super overrepresented or anything. So we'll see how things go in round two. Or maybe they'll get into Sloan in the first round and they'll just kind of stop there. I don't know. We'll see.
[00:25:21] Speaker B: Well, if they get to Sloan in round one, which again, they've probably got a competitive profile, they should at least apply to Stanford in round two, right? So they can up their game a little bit, maybe look at Wharton or whatever. But yeah, if they do get into Sloan in round one, there's probably several applications they can sort of put on hold.
[00:25:40] Speaker A: Yes, and you're now reminding me we did a video in the admissions academy and all those videos are up on YouTube. But we did one where we talk about school selection and how there's kind of adjustments that can happen between round one and round two if you're splitting across. And so sometimes people will look to upgrade. Sometimes they'll have to downshift if they didn't get in anywhere. So, yeah, keeping all that in mind. But, yeah. So we'll see where things fall. I want to thank them for sharing their profile and engaging with you and answering some questions on the site. But let's turn our attention now to wiretaps. Candidate number two.
So, our second candidate this week has six schools on the target list, and those schools are Columbia, Harvard, MIT, Kellogg, Stanford, and Wharton. So this is basically the m seven without Chicago booth. For one reason or another, they want to start school next fall. They are in the military. I believe this is an american, but they're located in Germany. US has a big military base in Germany. They're thinking about consulting after business school, although they do mention an interest in automotive, aerospace and things like that as well. But I think it's consulting in the short term. And they've got Bain and Booz Allen and BCG on the target list. They took the GMAT, the new version of it, and scored a 715.
So that's a very solid GMAT score. Their undergraduate GPA is a 2.90. So a little bit low there. Seven years of experience, presumably all of it in the military. Alex, you actually asked them to explain this GPA and. And give some additional details. So do you want to walk us through what else you know about this candidate?
[00:27:16] Speaker B: Yeah, they did their undergrad at Chicago, so they don't want to apply to booth.
[00:27:20] Speaker A: Ah, okay. So they don't want to double dip. Okay. That makes sense.
[00:27:23] Speaker B: I think that's. That might be the reason, right? Yeah, because that was one of the things they put down about their undergraduate record. So obviously not things didn't go well as an undergrad for a variety of different reasons. They're actually doing an MS. I think they're doing it. Or they've completed an MS in analytics at Georgia Tech.
And quite honestly, they got a 715 GMAT. So they're clearly very smart. Right. So if they can mitigate that undergrad degree, they've got the MS in analytics, they've got the super GMAT score if they're a military candidate.
Not all military candidates are the same, obviously, but if they can showcase some really interesting experience out of the military, too, I think they're going to be able to do well at some of these top programs.
They didn't get an interview, invite at Harvard. So that's an early negative signal, obviously. But we do know that Harvard, out of all the top programs, cuts deepest in terms of who they select for interview. Right. So lots of programs cut their applicant pool in half and then interview half and then admit a quarter of those, whereas Harvard would rather put them into a quarter and then admit half of those.
Something to that effect. Those number statistics aren't precise, but you get the idea. So they did get an invite at Columbia.
So that's a positive early signal.
And, yeah, again, they've got this one big blemish to their overall profile. To the extent they can mitigate that with that super gmat as well as their MS work, I think they could be, well, a high profile candidate. Grant.
[00:29:26] Speaker A: Yeah, this is a really interesting case because they explained that GPA, they mentioned a mix of financial woes, their mother's health decline, and then just going to a very tough school, which I can attest. University of Chicago undergrad has a reputation for being academically rigorous, but they really are testing the boundaries here in the sense that it's really hard to get into a top school with a GPA that doesn't start with the number three. They are below that 3.0 threshold. Now, I will say I was looking this up. That 715 on the new version of the GMAT or the current version of the GMAT is really like a 760 on the older exam. So way above the averages.
Good in the sense that you have to do that if you're going to overcome a low GPA. Did they tell us what their grade point average is in that MS and analytics? It's really high. Right? I thought they had shared that somewhere.
[00:30:20] Speaker B: I'm not sure if they shared it, but I absolute guarantee it's going to be super high.
[00:30:25] Speaker A: Oh, yeah, here it is. I found it. 3.85 out of four.
[00:30:29] Speaker B: There you go.
[00:30:30] Speaker A: I'm hoping that that plus amazing GMAT result, and obviously what looks to be interesting work experience. Seven years are in the military, they're overseas. There's got to be plenty to draw upon there. Maybe coupled with an essay that explains some of the circumstances surrounding that GPA, and maybe they'll get over the hump. It is a little discouraging that they didn't get the invite at HBS, but as you point out, they're making a really deep cut and so hard to read too much into that. I think we'll know a lot more when it comes to whether they're getting invites at the likes of Wharton or Stanford or these other programs on their list, so we'll find out. But yeah, I think this is one of those instances where someone can overcome that sub 30, but it's going to.
[00:31:13] Speaker B: Be tight and they've done everything within their control that they can do to try to overcome. So if they aren't able to successfully navigate the admissions process at top programs, they can't look back and say, well, I didn't. There's certain steps I could have taken. They've done the extra coursework, they've completely aced the standardized test, and yeah, I think they've done everything that they can. So let's hope it yields positive.
[00:31:47] Speaker A: Yeah, agreed. And I would say, I mean, if I were this person, and let's say things go horribly wrong in the first round, I would apply to some of these other top ten schools because I think they will definitely get in somewhere. And if they want to pivot into consulting, you could go to tuck Yale NY. I mean, there are many schools you could go to to achieve the career goals that they're looking to achieve. So I would say all is not lost if for some reason things don't come through. But I'm actually pretty confident they're going to get a hit somewhere with this group of schools. So we'll see. In any event, I want to thank them for posting and for their service. Let's move on, though, and talk about wiretaps. Candidate number three.
So our final candidate this week has six schools on the target list, and those schools are Babson, Cornell, Dartmouth, MIT, Yale and UCLA. So kind of the New England focus, plus UCLA here in Los Angeles. They want to start in the fall of 25, just like our past two candidates. They've been working in management consulting for a big four before business school here, and they're thinking about consulting afterwards, but looking to move into like a Baindeh, BCG or McKinsey. They have a 3.23 undergraduate GPA. They took the GRE and scored a 294, but they are going to be retaking that. They have six years of work experience to date, located in Boston, wants to stay in Boston. And they mentioned, you know, six plus years of experience in management consulting. They've had promotions.
They've landed in, you know, the kind of highest tier each year. I guess they get these kind of tierings at their firm that they're working for. They also do serve as an adjunct professor at their, I guess where they went to undergrad, which is, they say is a prominent business school. And they're very involved in their community. They serve as a mentor for underrepresented students. They're on the board at a nonprofit that supports minority first gen students, and so they also shared that they are first generation college student.
So, Alex, what do you make of this candidacy? I'm kind of curious about the school selection a little bit, but what do you think of their numbers and, yeah, just the overall profile.
[00:33:54] Speaker B: It is quite odd to add Anderson in there, which is a very good program, but they're not in New England like every other program.
I think, again, this candidate has some really strong aspects to their profile. Let's assume again, that their work experience is really strong. It looks like, or at least they've articulated that they're going to be able to show that growth and that impact, etcetera. And they're outside of work activities further complement that, their first gen.
There's quite a lot to like about this profile, but this GRE score is going to be super challenging.
Is it outside of the spectrum of GRe scores for the very top programs? I don't know that we know that. I know I've seen 80 percentile ranges for GRE scores that do dip into the lower 300s, but this is 294. So they've absolutely got to try to figure out how they can push that GRE score up as high as at least they can go get their best score. So target round two, at least one more retake on the GRE to push that up. And quite possibly, regardless of how they do with the GRE retake, do MBA math or HBS core or GMAx business fundamentals to further complement, because the undergraduate GPA isn't outstanding either.
I respect the fact that they've been invited back and they're adjunct faculty, so that can actually play quite well. But this combination of 294 and 323 will be troubling at several of the schools that they're targeting. So I would really encourage them to do everything that they can to get that test score up.
And just regardless of that, go ahead and do a bit of additional coursework.
[00:36:05] Speaker A: Yeah, I agree. I'm concerned. I like the storyline. First gen, they've got what seems to be great work experience at a big four, so they're kind of a known quantity in terms of being able to assess that work experience. They've got promotions, all that stuff, but the numbers do not add up right now. I mean, I think it'd be one thing if we're talking like they have a 315 on the test, you might say, well, they're within spitting distance. But the problem is, yeah, they're really low. And I would suggest that this. For me, this smacks of someone who maybe hasn't taken a, you know, a course on how to ace the Gre or really put in the time. Like, I think they just need to take, you know, maybe like, take one of these test prep courses or something. Cause you should. I mean, this is a smart person. They went to a good school. They're teaching at that school now, adjunct. I mean, they're getting promotions at work. They're clearly sharp. And so I think, and I'm not a big believer that these tests are truly, like, aptitude tests. I think that you can learn how to do well on them with a lot of practice and stuff. So, yeah, I would encourage them. Just buckle down, take the test again, apply in round two to these schools, and hopefully things turn out okay for them. I guess if they really are set on New England and they can't get these scores up. There are a couple of other schools in the Boston area. Both BC and Bu have decent MBA programs, so they could always add those into the mix if they had to. But I think, hopefully, a better GRE score is in their future, and they can, as you said, take business fundamentals or one of these other courses to just show that they're academically ready for business school. So, in any event, yeah. Interesting profile with this sort of blemish, and I'm hoping that they can overcome it as they go through the process here.
[00:37:40] Speaker B: Should they waive the test?
[00:37:42] Speaker A: Yeah, I was kind of wondering that. I mean, I think for some of these schools that allow you to, it might not be the worst idea.
I guess it'd be good to know what their undergraduate transcript looks like. Right. Because if you're going to apply to Cornell, for example, and request a waiver, then the admissions committee is going to look very closely at your undergraduate transcripts and try to figure out if, like, you're, you know, do you have the quantitative coursework? So I would need to know more before recommending that. I think they need to, at minimum, take this test a second time and try to get a good score.
[00:38:10] Speaker B: Good.
[00:38:10] Speaker A: Yeah. All right. So, Alex, thanks for picking these out. I know we're running a little long this week, but we had a lot to discuss, and obviously some great candidacies to review. But let's do it again next week. I'll be back in France by then and probably once again, superjet lagged going back the other way. But let's connect next week and do this again.
[00:38:27] Speaker B: Very good. Stay safe, everyone. Take care.
