[00:00:17] Speaker A: Welcome to the Clear Admit MBA Admissions Podcast. I'm Graham Richmond and this is your Wiretaps for Monday, March 10, 2025. I'm joined by Alex Brown from Cornwall, England. Alex, how are things?
[00:00:29] Speaker B: Very good, thank you, Graeme.
[00:00:30] Speaker A: So I know we talked about spring last, but it's been really nice here in Paris. The sun is shining and it's definitely feeling like winter is being pushed out. So that's good news here. How about you?
[00:00:42] Speaker B: Yeah, as soon as we finish recording, I'm hoping to go on a bike ride.
[00:00:45] Speaker A: Ah, nice. All right, so tell me what's been going on? Are people using our Chatbot still and asking interesting questions? What's been happening on the wires? I mean, we're getting really close. We've had some decisions coming. Right. Round two decisions have started with some programs last week. So what's on tap here?
[00:01:03] Speaker B: Yeah, Decision Weeks, as we call it internally, has certainly begun. Tepo last week was the top school, I would say that's released there around two decisions. Lots of wait list decisions, actually.
[00:01:17] Speaker A: Yeah, I saw that.
[00:01:18] Speaker B: And admissions decisions and admit decisions, I should say. But this upcoming week, we've got Rice, Jones, dad, and Goizata, Toc, Fuqua, Ross, and I can't read my writing. Mendoza and Georgia, Terry, Indiana Kelly, all have round two decisions. They're rolling out Minnesota. Carlson is round three.
And, yeah, I still can't read what that other one was.
[00:01:48] Speaker A: So wait, you're still writing things down with, like, a pen or something? Is that. I didn't know people did that.
[00:01:53] Speaker B: I use a notepad. I know.
[00:01:55] Speaker A: Just kidding. But it is funny. It's gonna be a lost art eventually, I guess, right? Yeah.
[00:01:59] Speaker B: Yeah. Well, that's the problem. I can't read writing.
[00:02:02] Speaker A: Yes. Someday someone will find this and wonder what the heck it is. Right?
[00:02:06] Speaker B: But, yeah.
[00:02:06] Speaker A: All right, so.
[00:02:07] Speaker B: So lots people, as you asked, people are still using our chat bot, which is very cool.
And yeah, no, we're going to see hopefully on. On the site lots of increased activity over the next two, maybe three, three to four weeks. So through the month of March is where the thick of the round two decisions are released. And Livewire is a great place for lots of activity as a result of that and hopefully Decision Wire too, as folks start making decisions on where they're going to enroll this season.
[00:02:42] Speaker A: Yeah, that's always super helpful. So, yeah, if you get a decision, please share it on Decision Wire. In terms of. Even if you don't know where you're gonna go, you can post undecided. So sharing that outcomes Data is great. I think it's great for the community to see where people get in and how they decide. So speaking of all that stuff, if get acceptance letters, one of the things that you, that you may not know is that people get invited to these welcome weekends. And you know, that's where the school kind of rolls out the red carpet. So if you're listening and you, you know, are anticipating getting some offers, you may get invited to these welcome weekends or welcome events, admitted student events. And we just did an admissions tip about this, Alex, and I remember when I was reading the tip, which I recommend anyone read, if you're going to be heading off to one of these things, I remembered one of the key points that we make about how to get the most out welcome weekend is a point that you've stressed repeatedly and that is it says if you have more than one acceptance and you find that the welcome events are the same weekend, where should you go?
How do you decide? And the tip that we give is go to the school that is your current top choice. And do you want to explain why that is? Because I know you feel strongly about that.
[00:03:53] Speaker B: Yeah, I mean, for a couple of reasons. One is, yeah, if you go to the school that you're not quite as enamored with, maybe you'll get overly influenced and so forth. But I think the main reason is this is the beginning of your networking opportunities with your potential peers, etc. Lots of folks are starting to look at where they're going to live, on campus, off campus, etc. Etc. So I think these welcome weekends are really important to start your MBA journey, not waiting until preterm and so forth. So yeah, that's in essence why I would encourage to really think long and hard, which is your order of priority. And if there is a clash, go to the school that you currently favor.
[00:04:44] Speaker A: Yeah, that makes great sense. So you can read that admissions tip on our website. There's a lot of other bits of advice on how to manage those weekends. It's obviously a fun time. So I still remember my welcome weekend that I attended at Wharton. So a lot of fun. Speaking of events, have a whole bunch of events on the calendar for May. You and I have been chatting the last couple weeks here about the MBA fair that we're putting on in Boston on May 14th. There are 24 schools signed up for that. You can go to bit ly mbafair 2025 to sign up. And it's, you know, everyone's coming, so it's going to be a great A great event and an efficient event if you're trying to see, you know, all the top schools in one place, you know, in one evening.
[00:05:27] Speaker B: Oh, Graham.
[00:05:28] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:05:28] Speaker B: Sorry to interrupt. I think it's Darden.
[00:05:31] Speaker A: Oh, you figured it out.
[00:05:33] Speaker B: Oh, no, I had Darden written earlier. It can't be done.
[00:05:36] Speaker A: Well, if you figure it out.
[00:05:38] Speaker B: Sorry about that.
[00:05:39] Speaker A: So, well, speaking of Darden, they're going to be at this event in Boston. So. Yeah. So definitely sign up for that if you can. The other thing is for those of you very far away who have no hope of going to Boston to hang out with all these schools for our evening, we are doing a bunch of virtual events in May as we always do. News is forthcoming on those, but there'll be four of those events over the month of May. And we've got a lot of top schools. Wharton, Stanford, Columbia. I mean, all, all the kind of leading programs are signed up to join us for those virtual events as well. So stay tuned for more details. I actually think we just ran a piece on the website about those events, so you probably can sign up at this point. But I'll get you guys a short link probably next week as we get closer and closer to, to May. But it's still, you know, plenty of time. So, Alex, other stuff that's going on, we did.
[00:06:28] Speaker B: I got it.
[00:06:29] Speaker A: Oh, you found it. You figured it out. What is it?
[00:06:31] Speaker B: It's our prior sponsor. It's Owen.
[00:06:33] Speaker A: Oh, Owen. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. Vanderbilt. Okay. So lots of news coming next week. I want to, we should wish everyone, you know, the best of luck who's waiting on those decisions. But yeah, it's going to be exciting. Next few weeks here we did a couple, Peggy on our team wrote a couple of really great articles about how MBA programs are integrating sustainability and then another one on the MBA and social impact. So encourage people to check those out if those are, you know, if that's kind of a domain that you're interest. And she actually, there's like a list of 15 leading MBA programs that actually offer an ESG specialization.
So environment, society and government specializations. And then the social impact piece that she did, I learned that she just pulled this out as one example. But she says a school like Yale SOM has over 50 different social impact related electives. Plus they also offer a separate kind of mba, Mass Masters in Environmental management. So there's a lot happening on this front. And we just ran a couple of stories to highlight that stuff so you can check those articles out on the site. I know, Alex, that's an area that you're pretty passionate about and have encouraged us to write more about.
[00:07:45] Speaker B: Yeah, I mean, quite frankly, this is super critical to the survival of the planet. So we need MBAs to be well equipped for our future. Right.
So yeah, no, really, really good. Like last year we ran a series of, you know, what top schools, specifically individual top schools are doing in the sustainability area, for example. So glad, glad to see that we're still quite focused in these domains.
[00:08:15] Speaker A: Yeah, definitely. Other big stuff on the website, we've kicked off our Real Humans alumni series and this is a series we do every spring. I think most of our listeners are familiar with the Real Humans concept. You know, we do it with current students, we connect with admissions directors. And this is the alumni series again. Just trying to show people that MBA grads are regular people and that they're out there doing cool stuff. So we connected with Gabriel. He was our first alum this year. And Gabriel is from a place called Gig Harbor, Washington, which just sounds like such a great name for a town. I guess there are a lot of rock shows there. I'm not sure why it's called Gig Harbor. Well, do you know this?
[00:08:55] Speaker B: Yeah, but let me check. No, no I don't. But gigs are also boats.
[00:09:00] Speaker A: Ah, okay. So it has to be that. Yeah.
[00:09:02] Speaker B: So where I live in Cornwall, we do gig rowing.
[00:09:06] Speaker A: Okay, so that's it.
[00:09:07] Speaker B: It's an event. So. So maybe it's nothing to do with your rock star stuff. I know you're a rock star and you have a bias towards other rock stars.
[00:09:16] Speaker A: Yes.
[00:09:16] Speaker B: But I'm guessing it might be a boat.
[00:09:18] Speaker A: Yes, it totally is. Okay, so Gabriel's from Gig Harbor, Washington, went to Tufts for undergrad in Boston, studied Econ International relations, and then I guess then went to work for the Federal Reserve Board of Governors. He also did some work for AT Group, which is like an economic consulting firm.
And then he ended up at HBS for his MBA, which he completed back in 24. And he's now working at American Express in an HR role. His title is Manager Chief of Staff at American Express. I don't really understand exactly the nature of his role, but the interview does get into some of the things he's been doing there. But we did ask him a question, which is what about your MBA prepared you for your current career? And he said an unexpected benefit of HBS's case method was that it provided me with the skill to think quickly on my feet, to tactfully push back on others ideas in a value creating way. Debating my Peers over hundreds of different cases gave me the communication skills needed to speak confidently to leaders many levels above me and nudge them towards the best outcomes for their teams or at least encourage a productive debate, particularly around topics that can be sensitive or uncomfortable to discuss. So I thought that was kind of cool.
[00:10:41] Speaker B: Alex, I think that's fantastic. And it's a clear reason for, you know, the case methodology.
[00:10:49] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:10:50] Speaker B: So, yeah. And we know that's Harvard's real core strength in terms of its educational sort of offering. So, yeah, absolutely brilliant.
[00:10:59] Speaker A: Yeah. Now, I did wonder, as I started to read his quote, whether maybe he didn't read the cases because he said he had to think quickly on his feet, you know, but because, you know, they have to read so many cases at hbs, and you've got to go into the classroom prepared because they do something called cold calling. And so, yeah, you got to be able to. To articulate your ideas in real time. A lot of fun.
Last thing before we talk about this week's candidates is that we continue to run our Real Numbers series. And this time we did two. There was one on GRE scores at US Schools and another on GMAT scores at international schools. Because we'd done the last week. So I just want to ask you, GRE scores, US Schools. We published kind of the averages across all of them. Any idea what school has the highest average GRE score in their incoming class?
[00:11:47] Speaker B: Stanford or Yale?
[00:11:49] Speaker A: Yeah, so Yale has a 330. Now that there's an asterisk, because it's their median. For some reason, they publish median, not average. So Yale has a 330 median and Stanford has a 327 average. So those two are absolutely the leaders.
One tidbit I thought was kind of interesting is that there are a handful of schools with lower scores that are kind of top schools. Right. So the average at a place like Michigan, Ross or Uva Darden is just 321. So a good bit lower than that 330 we see at Yale and then even, say, Georgetown or Indiana, it's like 319. So there's a pretty wide range of scores at some of these top programs in the U.S. yeah.
[00:12:31] Speaker B: Quite frankly, I don't get it. We talked about this for the last two or three years since top schools started to accept the gre. There's definitely an opportunity for those that are nervous about taking standardized tests, take the gre, not the gmat, because the averages don't relate. Right. So if you did comparisons, direct comparison between average, you know, if. If my I mean, let. I don't know what Ross's average GMAT score is. Let's say it's 720, 725. Somewhere around there. I'm guessing the equivalent average GRE would probably be 3, I don't know, 27, 28. Yeah, but again, I'm guessing. I. I'm not looking directly at the tables that tell me that, but. So I don't get that difference and why schools are persisting with that difference.
[00:13:23] Speaker A: Yeah, I would predict that that may start way. But we'll see. We will see. And then one last thing on the GMAT scores for international programs. So this is, you know, non US schools. Any idea who has kind of the highest average GMAT score at the non US school?
[00:13:40] Speaker B: Well, I do some work for LBs, so I'll throw in LBs, but obviously I'd throw in LBs with INSEAD because they're typically the top two MBA programs in Europe, or at least in my book. So what's the answer?
[00:13:54] Speaker A: Yeah, so INSEAD and LBS are at the top. INSEAD, just a tiny bit ahead of LBs, I guess. INSEAD says 708. Average LBs, 700. So, yeah, those are. And then when you look at some of these other top schools In Europe, like Esade in Spain, 660. ESMT in Berlin, 640, Oxford, 680. So one thing is the reason I'm mentioning those is because you see there's kind of an opportunity if you're, you know, if you're someone who hasn't done, you know, wildly well on these tests. It seems like the European school schools place less of an emphasis. It's certainly not, you know, their averages are lower than the top US Schools, for sure.
[00:14:29] Speaker B: Yeah, No, I think that's a very fair observation.
[00:14:33] Speaker A: Yeah. So potentially an opportunity. So let's talk about this week's candidates. I did.
[00:14:39] Speaker B: I will say, though, Graham, getting a 700 on the GMAT is very difficult.
[00:14:43] Speaker A: Oh, yeah, absolutely.
[00:14:44] Speaker B: We are talking at the top, top end of the spectrum. I. IQ spectrum or whatever you want to call it.
[00:14:51] Speaker A: So a couple other things before we talk candidates. You can always write to Alex and myself by emailing
[email protected] just use the subject wiretaps and we'll write you back. That podcast I recorded with Sam Fold, who's the general manager of the Philadelphia Phillies, is out now and you can listen to it wherever you're listening to this episode. That was a lot of fun, as I've been saying. But anything else, Alex, before we talk about this week's, candidates.
[00:15:18] Speaker B: Let's kick on.
[00:15:19] Speaker A: All right, so this is WireTaps. Candidate number one.
Our first candidate this week has eight schools on the target list. And those schools are Georgetown, Harvard, MIT, Stanford, Washington, Foster, UCLA, Anderson, USC, and Uva Darden. This person's hoping to start school in 26. They are a military officer. They're currently retiring from the military. They've completed their requisite number of years. And you know, that's an important point here because they've actually been in the military for 20 years. So this person's around 40 years old, I'm guessing. They had a 3.8 undergraduate GPA. They're currently located in Germany, presumably at the US base there. They want to land in Seattle after Brazil business school. And they indicate a desire to do either consulting or aerospace defense tech. I mean, they list a number of options and they mentioned some consulting firms and tech companies along with the likes of Boeing and Siemens as well. So they have a little bit of a wide net that they might be casting. And they did offer some additional comments. They just mentioned that they're, you know, leaving the military. Coming from an operations and strategic planning role. They've led teams of 80 plus people and they're looking to grow into a leadership role in a large company in the Pacific Northwest. Their undergrad degree was in Arabic language and culture. It was from a lesser known school, they say. But they did have that 3.8. They also earned a master's in theology from a seminary and again had a 3.8 in that program. They are still working to take one of the tests. And their biggest, biggest question is would it be better to go to an M7 program or a local MBA program if they want to find a position in Seattle. They're wondering if they should take the GRE or the gmat, if we have a point of view on that. And then they're also asking the million dollar question about should they be looking into executive programs because of their age or should they, you know, or should they be kind of working and going to school at the same time? Like they're really not really sure about that. So, Alex, I know you had some dialogue with them. So what's your take here?
[00:17:35] Speaker B: Yeah, I mean, I think with a 20 year military service, which is obviously fantastic, it's going to be difficult, I think for this candidate to pursue the full time MBA route again. It would delay their sort of transition into the private sector by another couple of years. So they'll be 42, 43 at that point.
I think a Better option is if they have the networks and the contacts and can get into a role coming out of the military in the defense sector. So you know, obviously there's natural sort of affinity for that coming out of the military. If they can do that and then explore MBA options, they might be better off and their MBA options are still very viable and valid and so forth.
And it might be a hybrid option, it might be a part time option, it might be an executive MBA option even at a top school if they want to choose that route or you know, they've got Stanford on their list, maybe they could qualify for their MSX program or whatever that one year program is at Stanford.
But so, you know, I think their first order of business should be to transition into the private sector and then to evaluate their MBA options to get those skills that they need to then navigate the private sector versus how they've navigated their military career. And you know, and I'm saying all this, one of my past lives was being admissions director at University of Delaware, which is a much smaller MBA program than we're used to talking about here on, on this show and you know, clear admission and so forth.
But you know, we had a small full time program and a larger part time program and some of the quality of the folks in that part time program coming out of Wilmington, Delaware were top notch and they were able to use, you know, the academic, you know, the faculty, absolutely fantastic, the academic learnings, et cetera, in sort of senior leadership roles even though they were just coming to the University of Delaware, not, let's say the Wharton School or other highbrow M7 type environment. So I wouldn't dismiss going to a more regional part time program once they'd gotten into the role that they're seeking. And I think obviously Pacific Northwest, one of the bigger programs they could be targeting obviously would be Foster and so forth.
Whilst they're thinking about that, looking at Stanford's MSX program and other sort of hybrid or less, you know, again, I'm just not convinced that the full time option is that best move forward. Graham.
[00:20:44] Speaker A: Yeah, it's tricky. I mean, I guess in a pinch an accelerated one year full time, you know. Well, I guess the MSX at Stanford is a one year degree. Right. But I think, you know, as you say, University of Washington might be a really terrific place for this person to land. And we were talking before we came on air, I mean they have an evening mba, they have a hybrid and they have an executive mba. So there's sort of something there. I'M sure for this person.
Real quick, what do you think about the test? I realize if they look at executive MBA programs, which by the way, we didn't mention it, but Wharton has an executive MBA on the west coast in San Francisco. So there are a lot of doors that start to open if they look at some of these hybrid or executive programs. But one thing that opens as well is some of these schools take the executive assessment, which is different test. But they were asking GRE or gmat. Did you have a point of view on that?
[00:21:40] Speaker B: I mean, I, I think if they got the chops to do it, do the gmat.
[00:21:43] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:21:44] Speaker B: But as we just discussed earlier, maybe getting the GRE done is more of a, an easier access. And looking at their, their academic profile, the there's obviously not as much quant in there. Obviously we don't know during their military career what sort of analytics, et cetera, et cetera they were exposed to. So might be the GRE is a better fit for them. But the admissions committees might be looking also at their quant profile. So if they feel confident I would tackle the gmat, get a good quant score on the GMAT and that that would help further open doors. I mean I got to think that I know coming out of the military for 20 years is a little bit unorthodox, targeting these top business schools. But I got to think that these top schools for their executive programs, part time hybrid programs will find this type of profile to be really super interesting.
[00:22:47] Speaker A: Yeah, agreed. So yeah, I think they just need to do some digging. I mean one of the issues, there are a lot of different programs out there when you start to expand beyond, beyond just a traditional full time mba. But I would start with Foster and Stanford, maybe look at Wharton Exec. And yes, I think the other thing they need to figure out is where are they going? I don't know when they're retiring from the military, but they need to start doing some parallel networking to try to maybe land that job, whether it's at a Microsoft or Boeing or somewhere out in the Pacific Northwest. So they have some work to do. But I think, yeah, hopefully this is helpful as they start to think through their options.
[00:23:23] Speaker B: I guess my overall point is secure the job first and then figure out the best alternative for pursuing their mba.
[00:23:33] Speaker A: Agreed. Yeah. All right, well, I want to wish them the best of luck, thank them for their service and for sharing, you know, their profile here. So let's move on though and talk about wiretaps. Candidate number two.
So this week's second Candidate. We go from an older candidate to a super young candidate. This person is still in college. They're looking at deferred enrollment MBA programs. So they're looking at Harvard, Kellogg, Stanford and Wharton. They're going to be applying this spring as you know. You know, you apply now, get in, then you go off and work for two to five years and then you join the MBA program. So they're looking to lock in a seat.
So they're going to be applying shortly. They've got a job already lined up for post college and that is a consulting gig with mbb. They don't tell us which one but they're going to consulting. They are thinking about something entrepreneurial, maybe after business school. GMAT score is a 725. That equates to like a 760 on the old scale in case you're more used to that. They have 4.0 GPA from undergrad and they mentioned that they're you know, a college senior at a time top 20 undergrad institution. They're majoring in psych with a minor in business and you know again going to be heading off to MBB to do consulting. They co founded a couple of college clubs and they've been working on their own startup while they're a student. They've had a lot of leadership roles. And Alex, one of the particular things that they brought up is that while that 725 is a 99th percentile and you know converts to a 760 on the original test they only got a 48th percentile in the verbal reasoning section. And that's because they got 100th percentile in the other sections that are those two sort of math oriented sections. So they're wondering, they know that a 725 is competitive but they're wondering if that verbal score is going to be a red flag and if they need to take the testing again. So what are your thoughts on their overall candidacy for deferred enrollment and anything about this test issue?
[00:25:41] Speaker B: Yeah, I mean I think the overall candidacy for deferred enrollment is about as ideal as you can get.
You know, 4.0 GPA, lots of great leadership and activities on campus, off campus stuff, startup experience, etc. Etc. Already an offer at an MBB coming out of college and a 725 total score on the GMAT. I mean if you're a deferred admissions candidate you've got two shots at this, right? You've got this one shot coming out of college and you know, only apply to Reach schools if you aren't successful, then you've got the second shot coming back in two or three years time applying through the more traditional route. So I think this candidate is in great shape. Obviously they're a little bit concerned about this 48% verbal reasoning score and yeah, it's a little bit of an anomaly but you know, they, schools, you know, they, they, they can, obviously they can look at their essays although you know there are various ways to write essays these days I suppose. But you know, in the interview, just checking their communication skills so just making sure that their communication skills seem appropriate, etc. So yeah, Graham, we actually slapped about this particular candidate. Although I know you said you don't remember.
[00:27:12] Speaker A: Totally forgot.
[00:27:13] Speaker B: I think we're in agreement, right that they're pretty stellar and again, if they're not successful, just suck it up and reapply in two or three years time with I mean the idea then is that they've got performance post undergrad to show that impact and growth and if they're starting off with mbb, it's got to be, you know, a very strong potential in that regard.
[00:27:40] Speaker A: Yeah, totally agree. It seems like they tick all the boxes. I mean they didn't tell us what they've done for internships over the summer but it sounds like, you know, if they're, if they've landed a job with one of McKinsey Bain or BCG Post College, they must have had some good internships. So yeah, this person ticks all the boxes. I would not worry about the test as you just go for it. And yeah, again the beauty of deferred enrollment applications is that there's no penalty if you don't get in. You can certainly apply in you know, a few years time. So but I think they're going to be well positioned that they will probably end up with at least one offer from of the four that they're going to apply to. So yeah, sounds like a, you know, everything's lining up well. So I want to thank them for, for sharing their profile. Let's move on though and talk about wiretaps. Candidates number three.
So our final candidate this week, Alex comes from someone who applied to. It's a decision wire entry and they can't decide where to go. So I'll give you the basics. They applied to Berkeley, Duke and Indiana Kelly. Okay. They are starting school this coming fall and they had a 625 on the GMAT focus. They had a 3.8 GPA. I can't remember what a 625 translates to, but I'm assuming it's like sort of high 600. So that's where they landed there. They ended up getting admitted to both Fuqua and Indiana Kelly and they have a Forte scholarship. So I presume that that means this is a female candidate. They didn't stipulate like how much. And I know some of those Forte scholarships are pretty generous, so I don't really know how much money is in play. But presumably that scholarship applies to whichever the, you know, whichever the schools they're going to attend. So they're torn between where to go. And the reason they're torn is that they want to land in, they say the eastern side of the Midwest post mba, but they also point out that they want to work in health care.
So they're hoping eventually to be chief marketing officer of a large group or medical consultant.
And they like the HSM concentration that Fuqua offers. So. Yeah, what do you make of this? I mean, obviously Indiana is nicely positioned with that eastern part of the Midwest location.
They want to work in healthcare. Duke has this sort of concentration in that domain. What do you think they should do?
[00:30:03] Speaker B: Yeah, I mean, I'm going to make the case obviously for Fuqua. Well, not obviously, but for Fuqua in this case, I think. I mean, Fuqua is renowned for its healthcare management program. Program. When we think of healthcare, we think of sort of the Wharton and the Kellogg and so forth. But Fuqua is right there behind them, potentially with Ross or a couple of others.
So I think that's important in this case because this person really has a strong focus in this particular sector.
And you know, I think Fuqua is also. Well, I know Fuqua is sort of in the tier above Indiana Cali.
So whilst Indiana Cali is a very strong program, Fuqua is just that sort of notch a little bit higher overall, which would give, you know, Phuket alums a little, little bit more geographic flexibility, I think, and certainly be able to place someone in, in the region that they're seeking, even if Indiana Kelly specifically is stronger in that, that sort of more localized sort of area. So I think when it all comes down to it, Graham, I think Fuqua does make a lot of sense for this candidate.
[00:31:21] Speaker A: Yeah, I tend to agree. I mean, I think both schools offer a really great, almost like quintessential kind of college town experience campus. You know, they both have beautiful campuses. They're in great locations. So it's. And they're great, great programs. But Duke does have the strength in healthcare and as you say, Duke typically ranks above Indiana and if the money's the same, you sort of lean towards just go to the best school you got into, especially one that suits your career goals. And I think I could not agree more. They can land in the eastern part of the Midwest out of Fuqua, if that's their goal from the get go. They just need to focus on that. So I think that's absolutely the case. I mean, I would have liked to have had a little more information on this candidate, like how much money they've got in scholarship, but it sounds like I guess it's going to be the same amount for either school, so maybe it's not as much of a factor. But yeah, just interesting. Would have been interesting to know a little bit more about them, but they didn't leave us a lot of details on their past experience and stuff, so.
[00:32:19] Speaker B: Yeah, no, that's fair. But again, I think it would take something quite significant to weigh the decision against Fuqua.
[00:32:29] Speaker A: Agreed. Yeah, definitely. So I want to thank this person for sharing. As we said earlier in the show, it's always great when you share your outcomes, even if you're undecided. It provides for great fodder on the show. But also I think it's just helpful for candidates in our community to see the decisions that people are faced with and how they're making them. So I want to thank that person. Yeah, yeah.
[00:32:48] Speaker B: Graham, I've got one point actually, as we go back to the first, the military candidate that we talked about, maybe they, they, it would be smart for them to listen to your podcast with Sam Folds.
[00:33:01] Speaker A: Oh, why is that? Because, oh, because he's in the executive program at Wharton. Is that what you're saying?
[00:33:06] Speaker B: Right. Yeah.
[00:33:07] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:33:07] Speaker B: And you know, obviously that MBA experience is very different to a full, full time, two year experience. So. So, you know, I, I just think it might, might make sense to sort of start to think about, you know, that type of route and, and that you, you mentioned that that's just been published, so I'm pretty excited to listen to it myself. So. Yeah, so I think, yeah, good for candidates thinking about, you know, working and doing an MBA concurrently and how to manage that and the impact of the MBA whilst working, et cetera.
[00:33:42] Speaker A: Yeah. And actually in that interview, Sam does talk quite a bit about, you know, disability. You're in the classroom one day and then you drive over to work and you're instantly able to kind of see connections between what you're learning in class and what you're doing at work. So, yeah, definitely. Good stuff. Alex, thanks for picking out candidates. As always. Great discussion. And I'll talk to you next week.
[00:34:01] Speaker B: Again.
[00:34:01] Speaker A: Again.
[00:34:02] Speaker B: Very good. Stay safe, everyone. Take care.
