Episode Transcript
[00:00:00] Speaker A: Foreign.
[00:00:16] Speaker B: Welcome to the Clear Admit MBA Admissions Podcast. I'm Graham Richmond and this is your Wiretaps for Monday, June 30, 2025. I'm joined by Alex Brown from Cornwall, England. Alex, how are things going this week?
[00:00:29] Speaker A: Very good, thank you, Graham.
[00:00:30] Speaker B: So any news? I mean, what's been happening? I still feel like we haven't hit preterm yet, so there's always opportunity for weightless movement. And we are seeing some activity on Apply Wire with new candidates showing up for the next cycle. But what have you been seeing?
[00:00:46] Speaker A: Yeah, I mean, there is still a little bit of weightless movement, but I haven't seen as much last week as I'd thought we might see and certainly relative to the week before. So maybe things are quietening down a little bit on that front. But I still don't think it's over if folks are still on a wait list. Schools are still trying to figure, you know, navigate obviously the, the international student issue and so on and so forth. So things aren't over yet.
[00:01:12] Speaker B: Yeah, I would sit tight. I mean, speaking of international students, just the latest in the, you know, kind of Harvard against the government sort of saga and just visa stuff in general. So as we said last week, the visa appointments are, they have a slightly different process where they're doing these social media checks of any candidates as well.
But those appointments are now open again. So that should be hopefully allowing candidates to go through and get their visas and come to school. But I do think because of this delay, as you say, there may be movement with wait list if somebody can't get things done in time. The other good news was that I'll read you a quote from the Harvard Crimson. A federal judge issued a preliminary injunction on Monday on halting President Donald Trump's June 4 proclamation, which banned travelers from entering the United States on a Harvard sponsored visa.
So you may recall, you know, that was like earlier in the month when he tried to, President Trump tried to do a little bit of an end run and find another way to sort of shut down Harvard's access to international students.
It was originally blocked and now it's been blocked again. And the Crimson goes on to say the order, which came less than four hours before a previous block on the proclamation was set to expire, will grant a reprieve to Harvard until the court reaches a decision in the university's lawsuit over the Trump administration's attacks on its international students.
And it signals that the US District Judge Allison D. Burroughs, who is overseeing the case, is likely to eventually rule in Harvard's favor. So that's kind of the latest there. It does seem like maybe we've got some light at the end of the tunnel here.
[00:02:50] Speaker A: Yeah, fingers crossed. Let's hope so.
[00:02:52] Speaker B: Yeah. The other thing I wanted to mention is we've got our event series starting on July 9th. There'll be four consecutive Wednesdays at noon Eastern. You can sign up for these essay events, which is where we really talk shop about all kinds of essay questions and how to tackle them as you apply to business school. So the first one on July 9th is going to feature Berkeley, Cornell, Dartmouth, Duke and Wharton. And you can sign up for these events at bit ly mbasa 072.
So sign up. We've got hundreds of people signed up for these events. They go on over the course of the whole month. It's going to be fun. Yeah. So. So get signed up if you're not already.
[00:03:29] Speaker A: Yeah, no, I think our most popular events. Right. So, yeah. So. And I know you're hosting them and, and, yeah, absolutely. Fantastic.
[00:03:37] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:03:37] Speaker A: 600 signed up so far, I think.
[00:03:39] Speaker B: Oh, yeah, I think it's. Yeah, it's. We've passed that amount and it's. It'll keep going up as we get closer to July 9 when the series kicks off.
Other news and notes, Alex. The folks at Berkeley have appointed Jennifer C.H. chapman as their 16th Dean starting July 1, 2025. Now, this is easy because the announcement basically follows Chapman's interim stewardship since July of 24. Right. So she's been in this role for the last year. She's the third woman to lead Haas in the school's 126 year history. And everyone loves her. She's a professor of management at Haas. And so she had been in the interim role, put her hat in the ring for the permanent position and has now been anointed. So that's kind of good news out of Berkeley.
[00:04:25] Speaker A: Oh, fantastic.
[00:04:26] Speaker B: Let's see other stuff. We've got some admissions tips that we ran. We did an admissions tip about defining your post MBA career goals, which is an important step to take for everyone, you know, getting rolling with their applications for the coming cycle. And we continue to roll out new entries in our mythbusters series.
The first one, sorry, the last one that we did that I'm going to mention here is it's a good one. It's round one gives you a huge advantage over round two. So that's the myth that we busted. But as you pointed out before we came on air, it really depends on the candidate. And that's what we get into in this little piece that we ran. So Peggy is having a lot of fun with that series.
[00:05:05] Speaker A: Yeah, absolutely fantastic. But, yeah, I mean, it can give you an advantage if you're overrepresented. I think that's the crux of it all.
[00:05:12] Speaker B: Yeah. Yeah, absolutely.
And then the other thing we've done is we continued to do admissions director Q and A's. As you know, that series has now been running for a coup weeks now with this season. It's something we do every year. We try to catch up with admissions deans at all of the leading business schools and have them answer a set of questions which we alter a little bit from year to year to capture, you know, what's happening at the time, et cetera. And the first one I want to mention is we caught up with Lindsay Lloyd, who's the assistant dean of MBA admissions over at NYU Stern and a friend of the show. She actually listens to the show from time to time, I think when she. I want to say when she's walking her dog, but I'm now, does that sound familiar to you, Alex? I can't remember what she said she does when she's listening, but I feel like it was that.
So what was funny is that she gave a ton of tips on their process, like how their process works, what their essays are, and how people should respond to them. And she even shared her favorite spots for coffee and to connect with students on campus. But I wanted to share a quote that she gave around. We have a new question this year in our Q&As with admissions directors. And basically is this question where we say, is there anything in particular that international students should keep in mind during the admissions process?
And we put that there both for general advice, but also given what's been happening with the current US Administration and the visa stuff. And so we wanted to just give schools an opportunity to speak to internationals who might be applying. But she said she chose to talk about something pretty important, and I thought it was a really great response. She said mastery of English is required for NYU Stern if you are not a native English speaker speaker. And if you have not completed a prior undergraduate or graduate degree taught in English, you'll need to demonstrate language proficiency by submitting a language test score. And then she goes on to talk about all the different tests they accept, which they accept all the main ones. And she said there's no minimum score required and the score will be evaluated holistically along with the rest of your application materials. So I thought that was good. I think schools vary in their approach to language assessment and I think this is a very clear policy on their part.
[00:07:18] Speaker A: Well, frankly, Graham, we need some admissions tips related to this because we do not cover language tests at all in our content. So yeah, maybe we need to.
Need to fix that, remedy that situation.
[00:07:32] Speaker B: Yeah, make a note of that, because that's a really good point. Yeah, we should do that. The other thing that Lindsay shared, that we also give anyone doing these admissions Director Kunais, a chance to just add any kind of final thoughts. And she shared a really great note. She said, I'd like to end by emphasizing the incredible community at Stern. I've mentioned EQ throughout this interview and that speaks to the importance we place on this core value here at Stern. We strive to model it ourselves. As Stern administrators and faculty, the people in our community are our superpower. Not only because they create a welcoming environment on campus, but also because it's their human capital that will ultimately set them apart as successful leaders of tomorrow. And I just want to say, I know that feels like catalog speak a bit, but it is. I mean, Stern is a really close knit, friendly place and I think they, you know, really try to find those people in the admissions process.
[00:08:20] Speaker A: Yeah, I mean, when I think all schools value EQ, right. And certainly more so perhaps in 2025 than when I was at Wharton in 2015, or maybe it was earlier than that. I forget when I left Wharton. Anyway, my point is Stern were the first.
Right?
[00:08:37] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:08:38] Speaker A: In terms of integrating EQ directly into their admissions process.
So whenever they began that, everyone followed. So kudos to them for leading that march.
[00:08:50] Speaker B: Yeah, totally. And I will say read these like if you're flying to Stern, like just go read this, this Q and A. I mean, we do them every year with for a reason. I mean, it's really useful. So if you're applying to these programs, there's so many good tidbits. And you know, we also caught up with Ann Kilby, who's the Associate Dean of MBA admissions at Georgetown. And you know, again, I'll just share a quick quote because I know we got to get get to our candidates and everything, but Ann had some great things to say too and again, some insights into Georgetown. And so we said same thing, students. We said, what should they keep in mind as they apply? And she said in the MBA application, we asked for candidates short term goals across industry, function and location. We want to hear an honest answer. We also hope the candidate offers a blend of being researched and also open minded for Example, we love when a candidate shares target firms.
However, it can be limiting if the candidate is too narrow.
We use the short term goal response as one way of determining if Georgetown McDonough is the right fit.
So I think good advice there. It's like whether you're international or not, I think you're hearing a little bit from her about how they think about this stuff. And I think it's like they want the specificity, but they also want to recognize that you're flexible. Right. And I think that's important in this current job environment, but also for internationals where visas are involved for work, et cetera. So, yeah, good advice.
[00:10:10] Speaker A: Yeah. I do think there's an extra sort of layer for international students. Right. Because they've got the challenge of getting firms to sponsor them, etc. Etc.
So obviously demonstrating that level of flexibility is good, but I would say you have to demonstrate that level of flexibility off the back of really deep research into what you really want to do and why you're getting the mba. So it's certainly not an excuse for having two or three different ideas that are somewhat randomly selected. Right. I mean, having flexibility should be a function of deep research into your career planning.
[00:10:51] Speaker B: Yeah. And I think, you know, obviously most of these programs are stem and you know, you kind of automatically get the right to work for three years in the US but then ultimately the employer is going to sponsor. I mean, that's what you want to have happen is the employer is going to sponsor you, you'll get an H1B, et cetera. So. And I think just having a good head on your shoulders and some flexibility instead of saying, I want to do this and these are the only two firms I would work for, you know that that's risky.
[00:11:14] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:11:16] Speaker B: So, yeah. And the only other thing I is we did ask Ann as well, like, was there anything else that she wanted to share, and she said that, and I didn't know about this. She said, we recently launched two new certificates, the business of healthcare and a certificate in global Real estate. Both certificates take advantage of Georgetown. Georgetown MBA's multidisciplinary focus on considering business. And in these examples, we're focusing on the intersection of business and healthcare, or business and real estate. I'm excited to plant the seed that we have other certificates in the works as well. So there's more to come there. But I thought that was interesting to know and that is one of the benefits. When you get an MBA from a large university with a wealth of resources in multiple disciplines, you can kind of Combine things. And that's what she's sort of stressing there.
[00:11:59] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, no doubt. Fantastic.
[00:12:01] Speaker B: Yeah. So the other thing that I had before we talk about this week's candidates is we caught up with an alum as part of our Real Humans alumni series. We caught up with this guy named Shoma Yasuda who is an ESA grad from class of 24 and works as a consultant at PricewaterhouseCoopers. He's 35 years old now. Was originally from Nagoya, Japan and studied at the University of Osaka for undergrad. Had worked. This is really interesting. Had worked in maritime shipping for eight years before going to business school and then basically left to go do the MBA and is now at PwC. And so I thought it was interesting, you know, what his story was. And so we have this question. We say, well, how did you choose to attend business school? And like, why? And he said, to develop problem solving skills and build networks. Prior to an mba, I worked as the project leader on a decarbonization initiative in the shipping industry. And to further accelerate decarbonization through skill enhancement, I sought to acquire knowledge through an mba, build networks in Europe, where renewable energy development like hydrogen are at the forefront, and engage in discussions with MBA peers worldwide on decarbonization and climate change in business contexts. So he successfully made this pretty big pivot and he recognized that Europe was a kind of cutting edge place for this stuff and so that's why he went to esa.
And yeah, so it's just an interesting story to go from kind of maritime shipping to PwC. It's a great kind of YMBA sort of story.
[00:13:34] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, fantastic. And it's great to hear that Europe's on the edge of innovation in something because you're getting overwhelmed these days on how far behind we're supposed to be in AI right behind the US and China. So kudos to.
To. To, you know, innovation in Hydrogen, I guess.
[00:13:54] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, totally.
So as always, you can write to Alex or me by writing to info clearadmit.com use the subject line wiretaps and we'll get back to you. Let's get into the candidates. I did want to say, Alex, I'm sorry, my voice is a little bad this week. I have a cold and it's a result of like all this travel I've been doing. But I' in in Kansas City today for the GMAC conference. And you know, it's. It's been. It sort of runs most of this week and it's a lot of fun as you Know we talk about this every year but it is super hot though in Kansas City. Speaking of decarbonization.
[00:14:25] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:14:26] Speaker B: And climate change and you know, I mean it's just like 100 degrees here every day it seems like. But in any event, and obviously you're.
[00:14:33] Speaker A: Going to go out and eat some barbecue which probably isn't the best food to eat during a heat wave.
[00:14:38] Speaker B: Yeah, I know. I'm hoping the place is air conditioned. Yeah, we're having a little party and some barbec and, and yeah, I will say Kansas City is, it's really nice. Like I, I've never been and it's exceeding expectations so far. So in any event, do you have anything else or should we talk about this week's candidates?
[00:14:54] Speaker A: Let's kick on.
[00:14:55] Speaker B: All right, so this is wiretaps candidate number one.
Our first candidate this week is applying to five schools. They want to start school in the fall of 26. The schools they're targeting are Dartmouth, Duke, Harvard, MIT and Wharton. Their pre MBA career has been in research at a biotech company. And they're thinking post MBA about investment banking.
It's funny because in their applyware entry they also mentioned consulting. But then in the description where they really fleshed out what they want to do, they seem to be very focused on investment banking. So looks like it's investment banking. They have a 329 on the GRE which is, is a terrific score. Their GPA from undergrad which came from a top 30 college in the US was a 3.4. They have four years of work experience located in Boston. Sounds like they want to stay there long term. And they mentioned they're 26, white male, been doing research at a pre clinical biotech and they want to switch into the business aspects of the life sciences industry. They're thinking, as I said, that they want to pivot into investment banking to learn how pre revenue life science companies are financed. And then long term they'd love to do corporate development at a biotech. And they mentioned they recognize their GPA at 3.4 is less than ideal because it's below the average at many of their targets. But they're hoping their GRE will offset this because they have that 329 on the test.
They have some good outside activities. They you know, have run like four half marathons. They volunteer as a coach for youth, youth soccer, etc. So Alex, what do you make of this candidate?
[00:16:31] Speaker A: Yeah, I like the volunteer for the youth soccer. I'm not. When I first read their apply wire entry I, I interpreted it as four marathons and I think that's really, really very commendable. Four half marathons, maybe not quite so much but you know they're fitness.
Yeah, yeah, but they're fitness. Right, so, so that's very good. Yeah but, but I like the soccer coach stuff so to the extent they can ratchet that up a little bit or, or if they're really passionate about that, I nicely in the application when it sits on top of what looks like really good professional experience to date on the research side of biotech.
So hopefully they can get good recommendations to back that up.
And as you said they got a 329 GRE. That's a very good score or at least it's going to be at average or just a little bit above from most schools. Maybe a point below the very.
Yeah one or two schools, but 329 is very good. They're a bit worried about the 34 GPA.
The context surrounding that is they walked on to be part of the rowing team or whatever it might be.
Rowing is quite popular in Boston. I assume that's where, maybe that's where they went to undergrad. And, and I forget what that river is. Right, that the Charles. The Charles, right. Yeah.
So, so you know, you know my point is if, if they can provide just a little bit of context around that 3, 4 GPA I think they should be able to mitigate that.
And I again I like the professional experience.
I like the goals Graham. I like the, the, the, the sense that they want to do investment banking to learn the finance side of, you know, however they explained it right pre funded biotech. Yeah.
And, and their goals related to biotech, et cetera, et cetera of the application is super strong. Their professional experience, their goal focus, their GRE just slight tweak on the 34 GPA perhaps.
And yeah, I think overall a strong candidate.
[00:18:42] Speaker B: Yeah, I tend to agree and I think that it's another. We heard earlier about the guy who was in shipping and went off to business school and had a really good kind of ymba and I feel like this, this fits in that regard of like hey they have this expertise but they really want to get on the business side of it. And they were pre med and undergrad in terms of the course track that they took which is why they're working in biotech and stuff. So they've had quantitative coursework. I think they should be able to convince an admissions committee that they can make this pivot into investment banking. And I would think an investment bank Might be interested in having someone on board who has this kind of industry knowledge. So yeah, it seems like a logical plan to me and I love the long term goal and yeah, I think this is a strong candidate. And I also was really happy to get the context around the GPA which at 3.4, I mean, you know, nothing to complain about but it is a little below the average at some of their targets and so their ability to just talk about being a walk on for the crew or rowing team at university will help. And they had an upward trend. It seems like they got better at juggling those 5am Wake ups to be out on the river. So yeah, no, I like this candidate.
[00:19:50] Speaker A: Yeah. It turns out they're quite a good rower too. Right. Didn't they? They were a silver medalist in some national contests, so that's right. So. So good success there too is obviously really helps.
[00:20:02] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:20:02] Speaker A: So I mean what rowing, rowing does show, right. A high degree of dedication. Right. This is not a sport where just because you're super talented you can just walk on and, and score goals and stuff like that. Right. I think rowing really is one of those sports that requires a lot of serious dedication to be super successful.
[00:20:24] Speaker B: Yeah, agreed. And it's teamwork and I was, when we had our NBA fair in Boston, I went for a couple of runs in the morning along the Charles and I mean all the folks were out there rowing crew and you know, whether it was like, you know, Harvard or Boston College, they all have their boats and their, you know, it's clearly like a serious team sport. So in any event, yeah, I think this person has a lot of qualities that are going to be appealing and I would just encourage them to, as you said, like just briefly explain the context on the gpa. And I think it needs to be something along the lines of look, while I recognize my GPA is a little below the average in your class profile, I want to just give some context. I was a walk on for the crew team and it took me a while to get to become adept at juggling all that stuff and had an upward trend from junior year on, et cetera. So I feel like they'll be fine. They should just explain that GRE obviously suggests they're smart and stuff so they should be in good shape.
[00:21:17] Speaker A: I would imagine their work product suggests they're smart too.
[00:21:20] Speaker B: Yeah, totally. Yeah. So in any event, I want to thank them for sharing their profile.
Let's move on and talk about wiretaps. Candidate number two.
So our second candidate this week is another like Sort of healthcare person. They are targeting an intake for 27 though, so they still have like another year before they need to apply. But they're coming to us early for some advice. And they have seven schools on their target list and the schools are Duke, Harvard, Johns Hopkins, Stanford, Chicago, UCLA and Wharton.
They currently have been working as a research product project manager for a top 10 academic hospital and post MBA, they're thinking about a pharma job. They list some companies like Merck, Pfizer and Roche. They have a 3.86 GPA. They have yet to take a test though, so that's something they're going to be doing. They've got five years of work experience. They're located in San Francisco and they just mentioned that they're looking at two year full time MBA programs but also the sort of Ms. MBA combo for biotech, life sciences, et cetera. And these vary from school to school, which is why they say etc. But so it's a dual degree that they're after. And they talk about how for their internship when they're in business school they'd love to work in hospital administration or health system consulting. They're thinking about large medical centers on the east coast or west.
And then in the short term like when they graduate they want to. And they have some really specific ideas here about like getting into a role like director of patient services or quality improvement lead or project manager for, you know, a private hospital or the large public system there.
Yeah. So that they have a lot of like very concrete plans here. And they also talk about a long term plan of being, you know, kind of senior leadership in a hospital system, like a chief operating officer or even maybe a chief, chief ethics officer. In their spare time they do a number of things. They mentioned that they're a mentor for first gen high school students. They've been doing that for a couple years. They're also a pickleball league captain. We've talked about pickleball before on the show and it seems to be of increasing popularity. And then the last thing they mention is they are a therapeutic riding instructor. And I guess they also maybe do some fundraising for this therapeutic riding program and they've been doing that for more than three and a half years now.
So in any event, what, yeah. What do you make of this candidacy? Because it seems like they have a lot of ingredients. They also have time on their side because they're not targeting, you know, an immediate application. But what do you think of this candidate?
[00:23:54] Speaker A: Yeah, I think maybe they should look at Kellogg2 in terms of their list of target schools.
I love the therapeutic riding instructor bit. I mean, to be a riding instructor and a therapeutic riding instructor, that, that says something about, about this individual. I mean, I used to do some volunteer work, therapy riding, but I was just leading the ponies around, so I wasn't the instructor and, and so forth.
[00:24:21] Speaker B: Yeah. For our listeners, like, what is this? Because I don't, I didn't, I'm not familiar with this when I saw this listed.
[00:24:26] Speaker A: Yeah. So, so basically it's for folks that, that have some form of disability that they, they can, you know. Right. Ride a h.
Quite a small pony type horse.
And but the, the beauty of it is they have some freedoms when they're on a horse that they don't have in the, you know, with, with their own sort of physical limitations, etc. Right, okay. So it's very popular and it's very good for their mental health too, as, as you can imagine. So, so yeah, I think this actually, I mean, I, I'm biased, right, because I'm a horse guide. But yeah, this really does stand out to me as an interesting extracurricular and I, you know, we hark on about extracurriculars when we're doing wiretaps and so on and so forth, but what extracurriculars do is allow what are already strong profiles to really stand out. Right. This is the icing on the cake, as it were, and becomes more important, I would argue for the very top schools that folks are targeting.
So I didn't mention our first candidate. I used to be a Cox. Right. So I'd be the guy in the back of the boat shouting at all these folks that are dedicated to their tasks.
[00:25:40] Speaker B: Oh, I didn't know that you used to row. Wow. Okay, well, not row.
[00:25:43] Speaker A: I used to be the cops.
[00:25:44] Speaker B: Yeah, okay.
[00:25:44] Speaker A: Yeah. Shout and steer and get thrown in afterwards mostly.
But, but I really admire the, the, these folks with, with very dedicated extracurriculars. So I like that.
And you know, it just seems to me, as you point out, this person's targeting 20, 27, so it's a little bit earlier in the process of thinking things through. So maybe adding Kellogg to the mix would be one thing to look at. They've really got to ace the test score, whether that's a GMAT or gre. Just give them enough time to resit the test if necessary. But I reckon that their work experience is going to be very strong combined with the extracurriculars. Again, really good goals. All makes sense. Just like our first candidate.
And a 386 GPA. That is absolutely fantastic. So. So, yeah, strong test score and. And so on and so forth. I think we. These first two candidates, both very strong. Graham.
[00:26:48] Speaker B: Yeah, agreed. And I think it's possible that the fact that they're looking at these dual degree programs will be another sort of feather in their cap, just further differentiation.
There are less people app these joint programs, and so I think that'll be helpful for them. But I like what I see. I think, you know, take the test, get that out of the way they've got, you know, I would, if I were them. I'd work on that over the next, like, four, you know, four months or so, over the summer, etc. And get that test out of the way. Yeah. And, yeah, if they get a really high score, that'll shape this list of targets. And, you know, I think part of the reason they probably don't have Kellogg on the list is it seems like they're very coastal in their approach here. Right. They talk about wanting to work on the east or west coast for a large healthcare system. And so I wondered if they think that because of, you know, but they have. They have Booth on the list. Right. So it's sort of like, why wouldn't they? Yeah, And I know Booth just got that $12 million donation for healthcare initiative, but, you know, Kellogg has a good healthcare program, too, so I would encourage them at least, like you say, look at it and see. But in any event, no really good candidacy.
[00:27:46] Speaker A: And you bring up this point of the dual degree, joint degree, or whatever, it is not forgetting that an MBA allows a large degree of flexibility in their electives to allow someone to focus on the healthcare and the science aspects of what they're trying to do.
So I always wonder if folks early on in their research are more inclined to look at dual degrees, but then they recognize that actually they could accomplish their academic goals simply through the mba looking at taking electives out of other schools within the university.
[00:28:24] Speaker B: Yeah, that's always an option, too. Yeah. I would encourage them to look into this. I mean, I think. Think you're right. It's a big commitment to do a dual degree, and especially if you have the right sort of or, you know, already have the right background from undergrad or your work experience. So, yeah, they should look into that. But in any event, I think, yeah, it's an interesting candidacy. And I love. We love early birds, and they're an early bird, and so I would just encourage them to stay out in front by getting the test done. And you know, do the research and stuff. But they seem to have a really good head on their shoulders. I've never, I cannot remember the last time I saw candidate who's like, this is what I want to do for my internship in business school. And then here's my short term goal and here's my long term. So they definitely seem to have things planned out, which is great.
All right, let's move on. I want to thank them for sharing, but let's move on and talk about WireTaps. Candidate number three.
So our final candidate this week has seven schools on the target list and wants to start in the fall of 26.
Their schools are Berkeley, Harvard, MIT, Kellogg, Stanford, Chicago and Yale. This person's based in South Korea. They have 10 years of experience and they have a 685 on the GMAT. Again, if you're still not used to the new scoring system, that's either a 730 or 740 depending. They have a 3.0 GPA and they mention in the note to us that they're concerned about this lower GPA and a GMAT score that isn't particularly high compared to, compared to the average. That's. That's their words. They also say that I guess they've been working in the public sector and they mentioned they've been responsible for planning, introducing and operating new technologies applying robotics, AI and cloud services to their organization.
They said that they think a key differentiator for their role is that they have planned, procured and managed projects typically ranging from 10 to $50 million, which is quite different from a traditional revenue generating role.
Their top choice, they say, is Stanford. And they're wondering, do you think that the unique aspects of their profile, which it sounds like are pretty heavily based around their work experience, are a strong enough differentiator when they apply. So. Yeah. What do you make of this person? Alex?
[00:30:29] Speaker A: Yeah, they need to answer that first essay for Stanford. Right. What means most to me and why? I assume Stanford still has that same essay. I haven't looked for next season.
[00:30:37] Speaker B: They. Yeah, I can conf. Yeah, I can confirm they're going to use it again.
[00:30:41] Speaker A: There's no evidence in there, their apply wire entry that they've thought through that and that's to me a little bit of a weakness of their overall sort of profile is we don't really know their sort of why MBA and post MBA goals other than it's technology related. Right. So it would be good to get a much better sense of their planning and what they plan to do.
And so forth. And that would then help guide them to identify the right programs for them, which may or may not include Stanford. It looks like their career, their work experience is really, really super strong, you know, huge projects, all in very topical areas like robotics and AI, etc. Etc. So, so they're, they're working on the frontier of where innovation is.
So I think that's going to be really positive. But I'm a bit concerned that they've got 10 years of experience. So that really then will put the pressure on articulating fit for each of the schools that they target because they're going to be a little bit of an outlier in terms of their career development as well as the sort of why now? Aspect. So why after 10 years does it make sense to stop your career and go full time for a couple of years to pivot to do what, et cetera. So that needs to be, be better developed. Yeah, maybe the 30 is, is a little bit of an issue. I don't know. I'm not sure if there's grade inflation in South Korea or where they got their undergrad degree from.685 seems like a very decent GMAT score, so I wouldn't be as worried about that. And as we talked about a little bit before we came on air, Graham, maybe they're actually better suited for the one year programs, the Sloan programs or at Stanford, the MSX program that typically targets folks a little bit more seasoned in their career and would allow them to return to their career sooner and so on and so forth. So there may be some, some investigation in that regard that might fit this sort of profile a little bit better.
[00:33:05] Speaker B: Yeah, it's an interesting quandary. Right. Because we, they didn't give us enough information. Right. So, or they maybe they don't know yet, but you know, we know need more clarity around their plans as you say.
But I do, just looking at the surface of it, I'm like, wow, 10 years of experience, that's going to be pretty above the norm for a lot of these full time MBA programs. Now I will say in cases like where someone's coming from South Korea, I'm wondering if that includes the kind of mandatory military service. And so you often do see some of these candidates out of a market like that being a bit older because they had to do military for a couple of years at least before. But still, still this person is more seasoned than the average. And so you make a great point about oh, should they be looking at like Stanford's MSX program and some of these kind of like sloan fellows at MIT and at LBs or something. Right. So I think yeah, that's an important question. Otherwise I would say if they're set on a kind of two year break and going the sort of traditional full time route. Yeah, I just would encourage them to look at programs that are going to really value this work experience and that may be on the margins. Have a slightly older student body.
I did wonder, you know, like INSEAD is another one that comes to mind that's not on the list here. It seems like they have all US programs but you know, there's another one that is a little bit better suited sometimes to older candidates. But I think like you say, a lot of this depends on like what is it exactly that they're going to do after business school. And you know, they need to flesh that out because that could sort of light the way for them.
[00:34:33] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, for sure.
[00:34:34] Speaker B: But the last thing I'll say on this is like we don't have information on kind of outside activities and the other key components of a candidacy. So it's sort of harder to know where they stand. And like you said, we don't have a great context on the 3.0 GPA. Ordinarily, if this was from a US school, we'd say, ooh, that's well below the average and kind of a little liability in this case. Yeah, maybe it was like the top school in South Korea and they're in the top 10% of their class with a 3.0. So it'd be good to have that context as well.
What do you think about their GMAT? 685. I mean they seem concerned that it's just sort of average for the top schools they would be applying to.
[00:35:14] Speaker A: Yeah, but it is average for the top schools right now. If they think that they could go back and retake the test and get a 705 or something and blow it out of the water, fair enough. Do it.
Yeah, but it is already at the average.
[00:35:28] Speaker B: Yeah. So I think they'll just have to provide some context on hopefully on gpa.
It'd just be good to have more information is what really this comes down to. But I, you know, again I would. Hopefully this gives them some food for thought about the programs they could be looking at and what they need to do in all cases with regards to their goals and clarifying things.
[00:35:47] Speaker A: Yeah, very good.
[00:35:48] Speaker B: Yeah. All right, well, thanks for picking these out. It seems like a good, you know, there was a little bit of a healthcare theme going and also a goals theme from our admissions tip through the admissions director Q and A advice and even into these candidates. So thanks as always, Alex. I'll be back home next week so we'll record as usual and get another episode together. Together.
[00:36:05] Speaker A: Stay cool, enjoy Kansas and stay safe. Everyone take care of.
